How to Get to The Main Cause of having no Energy Part 3 with Morley Robbins


Dr. Joel Rosen: Alright, hello, everyone. And welcome back to another edition of the truth about your health where it is our mesh mission to empower 100 million people to go from exhausted to energized. And no more is that evident in getting to the root cause of why you’re so exhausted. And this is part three with our special guest, Morley Robbins, who is the creator of the root cause protocol as well as the magnesium advocacy group. He’s got his BA in biology at Denison University and holds an MBA from George Washington, as well.

He was in healthcare administration, but now he spends his life dedicated to research and educating the masses on how we’re being hoodwinked on what our energy production revolves around. And almost everything we do and is taught in terms of his words being misled and misfed. Get us further from the truth and closer. So Morley, thank you so much for being here yet again, for part three.


Morley Robbins: Thank you so much, I enjoying this ongoing dialogue. Even more discussion?


Dr. Joel Rosen: Yeah, so yeah, so So you know, and again, I’m proud of my war-torn book here, the cure, cure your fatigue, how balancing three minerals in one protein is the solution that you’re looking for. This is how you would already be on my radar before that, but through my research, and all the exhausted and burnt out people that I work with just continuing going down those rabbit holes and understanding that the energy production problem is the number one problem whether you think you have fibromyalgia or in the case that we work with adrenal fatigue or HPA Axis dysfunction at the end of the day, you’re not producing energy at the level that you need to.

And just to recap what we’ve talked about so far, far, we’ve talked about the categories in your book, The why you’re so tired, being misled and miss fed information, how modern-day health care is anything but how we are being, I guess, removed from the truth of how your body may, because that’s not being taught in, in the medical tool, or healthcare schools at all. Also, what is the result of that is in terms of oxidation, and then ultimately, what do we do about it.

And one of the most exciting things that we talked about last time was stress and fatigue and the relationship between that and energy. And then ultimately, we started, we ended with the stops and the things that we need to do to stop decreasing the availability of the most important nutrient bioavailable copper so that our cells will breathe effectively. And it’s, it’s an either, or you’re either using oxygen effectively, to produce ATP, or you’re producing exhaust.

And if you’re not making an income, you’re creating an expense. And it’s even worse to create an expense when you don’t have an income. So here we are, and I wanted to get into the starts of what people should do, we’ll have the links posted so that they can get access to the first two interviews. But I think it’s a good place to springboard from Morley in terms of the starts. But of course, if you want to just catch us up with any thoughts that come to your head, before we do that, then, by all means, let’s get started.


Morley Robbins: No, absolutely I, what I enjoy, Joel is Evali, my twin in terms of being able to come up with analogies that people understand income versus expense, that’s really what it’s about. The other one that I’ve used over the years is, we’ve all at some point have had either done this personally, or we’ve witnessed it, someone trying to balance on a boogie board with where they’re like there’s a ball in the middle, and you got to keep your body in balance.

And anyone who’s done that knows the energy that’s required in the legs to maintain that balance. Well, that’s what this is all about. When we want to have metabolic homeostasis, stay in balance, you gotta be producing lots of energy. When we don’t have the energy, when we start to fatigue on that boogie board, what happens? We’re going to go to one side or the other. And that’s where most people find themselves when they’re in a state of exhaustion.

Whether we can use the phrase adrenal exhaustion or fatigue or chronic myalgia, whatever the fibromyalgia, whatever the right phrase is, there is a loss of cellular energy, and it’s on a scale, that it’s affecting our ability to stay in balance. But really, people need to realize why this energy is so important. Again, the phrase that I’m using of late is ignored the enemies ignite the energy. And it’s not to, to be naive that there aren’t enemies out there. We know there are.

But the body is amazingly designed. Once it has the capacity, the natural capacity to make energy. Pathogens go away, they disappear. They are, they are annihilated. Or they go back into their dormant state. And it’s just a, it’s a fact of physiology, that that’s how it works. And so the root cause protocol intends to restore energy at a macro level and a micro-level, restore the bioavailability of copper. And, and there are a series of steps that we go through.

And the most important is we did, we went through many of the stops in our last discussion. And I think it’s good for people to know that there are some critical roadblocks to allowing the body to restore its energy. One of the big roadblocks is being allergic to your environment. You know, there are people that that are reacting to their foods, they’re reacting to mold, they’re reacting to whatever the factor might be in their general environment. And that reaction is a histamine response.

You know, mast cell activation disorder, whatever the right phraseology is, and histamines are very powerful hormones, as you well know. They are the hormone of alert, letting the body know we have a crisis. You’re talking about the stuff outside the cell and the stuff inside the cell. Well, what do histamines do it ejects potassium and magnesium out of the intracellular space, and it floods the cell with calcium and sodium, and water to try to flush out whatever the problem was?

And in the short term, that’s a good thing. But if it’s being done on a chronic basis, as you know, it’s a very bad thing. So we encourage people to do techniques like in an et, to begin to turn off that

Aramis message is basically what it is that there, what I’ve learned over the years, more by inference than by information, but But when I’m dealing with someone highly sensitive to their environment, they’ve got this much copper, and they’ve got this much iron, it’s that they’re out of control with iron, really destabilizes the capacity to stay in balance.

So controlling the histamine response is very, very important. It’s a and what, what people need to know is that the master antioxidant protein, it’s like glutathione, everyone loves to talk about how important glutathione is. It’s important. But the master antioxidant protein is so Reuleaux plasmin It expresses about 20 different ways in the body are one of the most important is in the presence of histamine. There was a fourfold rise in the expression of histamine as we know it has diabetes oxidase. But histamine ace back in the late 1940s was the enzyme that broke down his two types of meat. So what So what does that say? Well, if you’re copper deficient, if you have low bioavailable copper, you will be more vulnerable to the histamine response.

Because you cannot mobilize the histamine is an enzyme to neutralize it. It’s a big deal. So huge. So overactivity to the environments, number one, number two, too much iron. And I think part of the challenge in the modern era, is to get past the narrative of urine EMIC. And your copper toxic. It’s, you refer it as the paradox. The paradox is, it’s the inverse of what we’re being told it is. And most people are, they may present with low iron in the blood. But it’s stuck in the tissue because it’s not going to get properly recycled.

And I know we’re going to talk about that a little bit. So that the ability to recycle that iron. It’s paramount. And one of the things that we encourage people to do is to do blood donations regularly. You know, if you’re a guy and postmenopausal woman, you can do a blood donation probably every quarter. If you’re a cycling woman, so with your menstrual cycle, probably two Three times a year is still advisable.

And because that, that, that loss of blood is atonic, it forces divide mobilizes the body to replace all those red blood cells, which is a very important process to reignite the body because most people have never given blood in their lifetime, which is kind of a scary thing, but it is what it is. And then there’s a third phenomenon, that that’s probably it might be as it might be more significant than anything else. And that’s the notion that whenever we have unresolved emotional issues, they’re going to become fear inside our psyche. And fear is a very powerful emotion as I think everyone can attest to.

But, but there’s important research has been done around the emotion of fear, and the fact that it creates hypoxia, which is not a good thing on a metabolic level. And a very important study was done by Zalman Pura Zamin. Pra 2018 looks at how this fear creates hypoxia in cells and cancer in humans. And what’s important for people to understand is that, that the emotion of fear triggers two hormones, adrenaline, and cortisol, or adrenaline fuel injector, but has a very powerful relationship with iron. And what you don’t want to do is mix adrenals, adrenaline, and iron, because that’s going to create Adrenochrome. And that’s, that’s the fuel for schizophrenia.

And cortisol triggers a four to five-fold increase in MaTeLo, signing protein. And what’s the telethon Endo, binds up copper 1000 times stronger than it binds of zinc. So effectively what you’re doing when you’re in a state of fear, you know, acute fear is one thing, chronic fear. And again, we’re only we’re, we’re 18 months, almost two years now into a chronic state of fear.

And that has a profound effect on our copper status, our bioavailable copper status, and our ultimately our ability to make energy. So those are some powerful roadblocks to get in the way. The fourth, that we’re beginning to dip our toe into an ideal with some degree of trepidation. But I think it’s a very profound state that we find ourselves in, where we know there are multiple pathogens out there. And we have a real sense of we have a real understanding of bacteria, yeast, and viruses. We seem to be fuzzy about parasites. And it’s, it’s that tiny medical school, I have a friend who undergrad at the Naval Academy, went to nuclear sub school.

And then as he decided he wanted to be a doctor, and his he, he said, is a medical school as a joke compared to nuclear sub school. But he said it because he was going to be stationed overseas. He specifically took a course in Paris cytology with one of his classmates. And he said, It’s, he thinks it’s one of the glaring weaknesses of conventional training, that these parasites are wicked, I think we’re learning that we don’t need to dwell on that.

But what we’re realizing is that parasites are good at living on iron, and destabilizing copper status. And what I was shocked to learn last year, I reading a patent application, and patent applications are based on this a deposition, you know, it’s a legal document, that you’re transmitting information that that has the basis of, of law, if you will, and this was a particular patent for a drug to deal with multiple sclerosis.

And patent application, so it would be good for the reader to know that autoimmune disease is a byproduct of parasites affecting the immune system. Well, that was the lightbulb moment because suddenly a lot of things begin to make more sense then. And so you know, there are over what is it over 100 different expressions of autoimmune now. So again, it’s, it’s sort of an uncomfortable

merger of two eyes. Ideas, energy, and enemies, right. But what we’re realizing is that, that these parasites are easily overlooked. And the typical response is to go after them, the gut detox programs, well, parasites are all over the body. And they’re there for a reason. And so we have to address them with frequency, not necessarily with chemicals.

So we’ve identified these four cornerstones of roadblocks if you will because what we need to do ultimately remove as much of the noise, the chronic stress that we have in our lives so that when we start to focus on that starts, the body can begin to get its mojo back. And, you know, again, people need to refresh their understanding of the stops, because most of those are dissing mainstream recommendations, especially in the current era, but at the starts are designed to restore copper, and to restore the bioavailability of copper, and begin to inject more mineral balance, if you will. And so we put particular emphasis on things like bee pollen, and real vitamin C, as opposed to ascorbic acid.

They’re very different. You know, real Vitamin C is an antioxidant. It’s a complex that has six moving parts like ascorbic acid is a pro-oxidant. And it’s in the literature, it’s a very hotly debated point. But the fact of the matter is, real. Vitamin C has an engine at its core called synthases. Now, what will be a very educational moment for your listeners is to look up in food journals. All of the tyrosine kinase inhibitors, wink, wink, get it. We don’t want the food to spoil.

What are they doing? They’re introducing tyrosyl ACE inhibitors in our bodies through food. And people don’t realize how critical darkness is to the function of the human body that melatonin, melatonin, which it is produced, and every mitochondrion. It’s the chemical expression of darkness. And it’s a very powerful antioxidant and the role that melanin plays in restoring and maintaining our energetic balance is profound. There’s even a theory out of Mexico, that melanin encapsulates the mitochondria.

And it’s just it’s the work of bolus, Herrera, amazing son, son, man, Solis Herrera, but it’s phenomenal work about our we do have a blind spot around tyrosyl As if it’s doing way more than just hair color, eye color, and skin color. And it’s just there. It turns out there are dots on our skeleton. And on a chimpanzee, there are 11 dots in on a human spinal cord, there are 12 Dots. That’s fascinating to know that those dots have a metabolic purpose in their physiology. And so it’s important to understand that vitamin C real vitamin C is profoundly important. And in an era where the mineral content of the soil is subject to question, we do need to turn to supplements to make sure we’re getting our requisite amount of tyrosine kinase.

And then we have to focus on the beef liver as a prime source of many nutrients, not the least of which is healthy cow eating. properly nourished grass is going to have twice as much copper as it has iron. We’ve been raised to believe that the liver is an iron organ, when in fact, the liver was designed to store two nutrients. Retinol, vitamin A and copper Petasites Live for retinol and vitamin A skin, retinol, and copper. And that’s the seat of where the bulk of the Sula plasm is produced in the hepatocytes of the liver. So beef liver, and there are other animals that we can use.

But there’s a difference in the concentrations, not all liver is the same. There are dramatic differences between Deif liver bison liver Cheap liver, you know, I don’t know, elk liver there, you just need to look it up in a nutrient profile. And what you want is you’re looking for a bolus of copper, bioavailable copper. And what’s a very rich source of retinol in our diet? It’s liver, what you want to stay away from his polar bear liver, you know, it’ll, it’ll knock you over and, and you’ll probably go into a coma because of the number of nutrients and in the polar bear liver. But the thing is, there are these nutrient-dense sources of food out there. And so we put priority emphasis on those, we put tremendous emphasis on the importance of minerals in general, particularly as it relates to making sure you’re eating foods that have been properly raised in mineral-rich soil, but mineralize the water that you’re drinking, and make sure that you’re not afraid to put salt, you know, proper salt on your food, because that’s what our ancestors did. What is the word? What is the word salad mean? It means salt. So what makes the salad special is to sprinkle it with salt.

That’s what brings it to life. And we have been horrible, as you, as you’ve noted, misled and miss fed, because we’ve been told that, oh, sodium is bad. It was never the sodium was the pump, they took potassium out of the picture. What’s hypertension? It’s too little potassium. You don’t have potassium in your system. There are all sorts of miscommunications. And it’s, I think it’s worth noting for the listener. what’s the, what’s one of the most effective ways to cause renal, potassium wasting.

take vitamin D supplements. Dr. John Ferris, noted professor of medicine at Yale Medical School in 1962, wrote an article to that effect. Nobody knows about it. But as soon as you lower potassium in the cell, again, back to inside-outside, when you lower potassium in the cell, guess who comes flooding in iron. And it’s, boy.


Morley Robbins: that’s that. That’s not something you want to get excited about. But it has a profound effect. And multiple studies look at that very dynamic. So there, there is the tremendous emphasis placed on making sure that we are restoring mineral status.

One of the more popular ways is what we call adrenal cocktails. It’s a very simple concoction that was I came upon it by a nurse who became a naturopath. It was Susan Blackard. She was outside of the St. Louis area. And it’s you know, take four ounces of fresh-squeezed orange juice, take a quarter teaspoon of sea salt, a quarter teaspoon of juice at the time was using the cream of tartar but your preferred form of potassium and drink it. MID morning, mid-afternoon.

Why mid-morning, mid-afternoon, because those are the classic adrenal drunk times. Who did the original research of that about when did the adrenals get weakest? Oh, it was Dr. Pepper. If you remember that, the logo for Dr. Pepper was o’clock face 10 to four. With you. Joey may be too young to remember that. All right. But I grew up with that. And of in the Dr. Pepper of today is very different than what I grew up with. I can tell you that. But the point is, they knew through the research that their adrenal function, sagged around 10 o’clock when we go for coffee.

And between two and four o’clock when we have another coffee break. It’s like we’ve just been conditioned. Yeah, I need a jolt of caffeine, when in fact, the body’s supposed to be restoring its energy production. And how does it do that? We’ve got to have that. You’ve got to have bioavailable copper. And I think one of the best explanations for adrenal fatigue comes by way of Tom Callan noted Bay Area physician, I think he’s now retired, but he calls adrenal fatigue, fat Deficiency Syndrome.

It’s absolutely genius. And what’s the fat? It’s retinol, and where’s 95% of the real vitamin C stored in the human body? In the adrenal glands, the ad, renal adrenal is on top of the renal glands. And you got to have retinol. You got to have that copper and that’s when the magic happens inside the adrenal glands to produce the 50 hormones that they’re supposed to be synthesizing day in and day out.

You know, I what I find entertaining. Is, is this little butterfly here, this elliptical at the thyroid you know, It makes one hormone, right? And all the electron microscopes and telescopes are all focused on the thyroid, and what are we taught are the adrenal glands that you don’t matter that that’s all Hocus Pocus 5050 hormones. Come on, folks, let’s, let’s put the, and I think you understand that if that’s why you put such a priority emphasis on it. But again, it’s another case of a paradox.

The focus is here, when in fact, your focus is where it belongs back on the adrenal. And so, we put particular emphasis on things like boron. Bowron helps to regulate Iran, boron has a very powerful relationship with oxygen, it seems to stem the creation of oxidative stress, which is very, very important. But we also use things like diatomaceous earth, and rice bran is just a very rich source of A B vitamins. And as is the liver that we talked about the diatomaceous earth is it’s just a very low-tech way of dealing with pathogens, parasites, especially. It’s not, doesn’t taste great, but it’s very effective at what it does. And then we also towards the end of the process, introduce iodine.

And it’s not that we don’t understand what iodine does. But here’s a part that people may not know. One of the most important properties of copper is the enzyme called Ferro oxidase. And what that enzyme does is one of the oldest enzymes on the planet, it turns

ferrous iron as valence into ferric iron plus three valences, so that the iron can be properly loaded on to either transparent or can be properly stored in the ferritin protein. Very, very important function. So Ferro oxidase, it’s the classification is called multicopper oxidases. Again, these are ancient enzymes that go back to the beginning of oxygen on the planet.

Allegedly, there are over 1000, different expressions of multicar peroxidase are in our gut, let your mind get going around that thought. And the key is being able to turn ferrous into ferric. Iron, very, very important for proper iron regulation. And when and when that happens, water is given off when copper is the mineral running that enzyme important. Water is a good thing. We know that. But turns out that iodine has very similar properties. Iodine can also convert ferric sulfate, ferrous iron into Verica. But there’s a catch. There’s no water.


Morley Robbins: So why is Why is Iodine so popular? Because it deals with the culprit. The true culprit of all of our unrest is dysregulated iron. And unlike Ferro oxidase, which has this natural capacity to recycle itself. Iodine, you got to reload it every day. And big pharma loves that. And so the practitioners who are pushing iodine are doing it for the right reasons. But they don’t understand what the implications are. And I think there’s undue emphasis on the thyroid.

Because the thyroid does not run the party that maybe that’s a discussion we can have another day. But that is again, another paradox, as you say, and it’s meant to confuse the heck out of us. And it does. So it just, there’s a lot of mythology behind the steps that people take to get healthy. And they don’t understand the true physiology of it. And only I’m beginning to understand it, I think you certainly are a student of this as well. And we’re trying to make sense out of this very chaotic series of instructions.

We’ve been given do this do that. But now we’re beginning to understand the physiology of it, and the metabolism of it and the energetics of it. And what we’ve been told in the conventional world makes no sense in the world of energy. And so that’s really where I put the priority emphasis. So that’s at least an initial overview.


Dr. Joel Rosen: I have some goals Let’s hear I don’t know if I’ll be able to get all to them. Because there are so many great things that you just said there. Barley. The first thing, though, is originally what you talked about in terms of having the energy to run your body, I think a lot of people don’t understand, well, I don’t have an energy problem. They think at the macro level, they think, Well, you know, I may not have the energy to run a marathon, but it’s not that, I don’t think energy, for those that have the shades of grey problems of not having cellular respiration, they don’t understand the importance of cellular energy.

And when we talked about before we got started today was the ability just to be able to have those cells respond and get nutrients like histamine reaction, flush out the tissues, and be able to depolarize the cell and be able to get information to and from the cells so that your systems run properly, ultimately, so that’s what we’re talking about energy. The analogy also I like from what I’ve heard is the metabolic reserve. And that’s where the adrenals come in, in terms of maintaining homeostasis. And even like the new term hormesis and giving it different stressors and aloe stasis is the ability to bounce back.

And, and ultimately, the analogy is you’re a canoe and paddling upstream, that you’re going upstream with, and you’re working hard to maintain or go forward. But there’s the metabolic drift, where ultimately you fall behind, and you’re working a lot harder just to catch up, let alone fall over the waterfall. That’s really what the energetic problem is in the cells per se.

The other thing I wanted to mention was just as far as the autoimmune, it’s really interesting too with the parasites, I’ve heard it be in terms of the autoimmunity first starts with nutritional deficiencies. And that would kind of go along the lines of if you’re not breathing effectively, and you’re oxidizing, then you’re depleting yourself of your minerals, and you become mineral imbalanced. And then you are more susceptible to two evils, as you’ve mentioned it. So yeah, a lot of interesting things there that the thing I wanted to talk about too, with you is the fact of the energetics of getting nutrients into and out of the cell.

I think that’s important. But before we go there, we had talked about the recycling of iron. And so I think that’s important for people to understand, because I know that’s gonna take a little more information, if we get back to the I think we did talk a lot about just making sure that we have the proper energy to run the system. So as far as the recycling of iron, so as you mentioned in the book, ideally, we’re in taking one milligram of iron per day 95%, maybe you can correct me 95% of the iron that we have in our bodies recycled.

So I tell people to think of it as like an assembly line where you eat food, and there’s iron going to be in the food. And as you wrote down so eloquently in your book, it’s not that we don’t absorb iron, we over-absorb iron, or we keep iron stuck in our Inteiro sites. And when people say, Well, I’m iron deficiency, or I have iron anemia, I don’t absorb iron, they need to understand you don’t get iron into your bloodstream, if that’s what you mean by absorbing be absorbing Internet sites in the intestinal area is not getting iron out of those places. But either way, you get iron, it gets absorbed.

Ideally, if everything’s working, all things being equal, it gets exported or transported in the tissues and into the blood. It goes into the cell it gets used. And then like our environment today, we want to recycle. The parts that we don’t use are the parts that we use but are inorganic, or they’re metals, right? And they need to be able or they need to be able to be reused again. And so you know, that’s why we have this recycling system. And anywhere along that assembly line that doesn’t work effectively is going to create stress in the body or oxygenation that is going to mix with free radicals and instead of making energy, it’s going to create exhaust. So why don’t you explain because I would like a little deeper understanding of myself as well as the listeners as what goes wrong with the recycling of iron and how copper plays a role in all of that.


Morley Robbins: We have a couple of days to talk about

Dr. Joel Rosen: This. Yeah, right. Sorry. Yeah.


Morley Robbins: This very, very important issue. And I think what you picked up on the process of iron absorption, two-step process, the first step is getting the iron into the internet site. Again, pretend this is an interior site, this is the villi, this is the body of the cell, and the bloodstream is down here. And so the iron is got to get from the, from the villi into the body of the cell, but then it’s got to get out of the cell out of the interstate into the bloodstream. So, that requires some degree of sophistication. And turns out, it’s really easy to get iron into the enterocyte. Easy peasy. There are all sorts of reductase enzymes to make sure that, again, that the iron is in our food system is there, there are five, five doorways for iron to get into the entire site. That’s a good thing to know. Like, like the body’s like, come on, in, come on, in, come on, in. Getting it out, not not as easy. And so the key is that there’s a, there’s a front door, and there’s a back door, front door, lots of front doors, you can see all these different front doors, the back door. It’s called Ferro Porton, an iron doorway, a very important doorway. And it is run by a copper doorman. And if an enzyme and it’s a Ferro oxidase enzyme, and it’s called her Festen.


Morley Robbins: So what you have in the human body are three different expressions of Ferro oxidase. We have so Rouleau plasmin, which is in our blood and our tissue, but for the most part, is in the blood. We have her Festen so play on, on the Greek mythology about the ferns, but Festen, very important expression of Ferro oxidase. Particularly on the internet sites.

It’s in our eyes, it’s another issue, but for the most part, it’s in the gut. And there’s a third expression called cyclo pan, Cyclops, Cyclops, again, the hematologist seems to have a real sense of humor with Greek mythology. But cyclo pen shows up in the placenta of the pregnant woman. And what’s worth noting is that a pregnant woman expresses all three. So Rola plasm, professor in Cyclopean. And guess what earthing practitioners never measure copper status. Interesting.

So how Festen is vitally important to make sure that the iron that’s in the internet site can be turned into a plus three form because what happens is when it’s coming into the interior side, it doesn’t matter what form it is, it’s going to be plus two inside the body of the cell. And then to get it out of the cell, it’s got to be turned back into a plus three into a ferric form. Now, if you or I were designing a body, we probably wouldn’t do that. But for some reason, there’s this valence change when you’re going through membranes. And copper is essential for those valence changes.

But the iron that gets into them TerraCycle gets into our gut, to be properly absorbed, needs to get into the bloodstream. And the critical factor is ferric iron gets attached to trans Ferron. Transport transports iron transparent. And that iron is going to go one of two places, it’s either going to go to the bone marrow, where new red blood cells are made, or it’s going to go to the liver.

It doesn’t go to 78 places. And the part of our anatomy that has the highest avidity or attraction for iron is our bone marrow, absolute off the chart need for iron to maintain the production of red blood cells as we’ve discussed. And so, the Festen expression of Ferro oxidase does three things. It changes the valence, accelerates the movement of iron through that doorway, and it secures its attachment to transfer. That those are three very powerful things that need to happen.

And so, the iron thing goes to transparent and then at some point But it’s going to get incorporated into red blood cells. And as we’ve noted in earlier conversations, every second of every day, we make more than 2 million red blood cells, which is a mind-blowing number.

And then the 5% 95% is that 5% of the iron we need for that recycling program. one milligram comes from our diet 95% of the iron needed for that recycling program comes from over the higher we need for the building of red blood cells comes from a recycling program, but only talking about the small amount of iron, but 95% of it is from a recycling program. So let’s drill in a little deeper. And so the formal name of the system is called reticular, endothelial system.

RNAs, and it’s a really scary term, particularly endothelial took me almost two years to figure out that meant recycling. Like, wow, okay, so why is this such a big deal? And here’s one of the great unknowns of human physiology, Joel, you’ll get a kick out of this.

We know that in the red blood cell, it’s a waiter carrying oxygen. That’s where the oxygen molecules go, Wait, breathe in. This is a rich supply of hemoglobin, they’re, and they’re offloading carbon dioxide, and they’re unloading oxygen.

And thank God they do. And then they start to get circulated the body and where are they going? They’re going to all the cells that need oxygen, to make energy. And it’s just your mind boggles at the amount of RBC traffic that must be taking place around the tissue. But this is the great unknown. We got these red blood cells carrying oxygen. They can’t make energy aerobically. Carrying oxygen, but they can’t use it. So they make energy anaerobically.

What gives the red blood cell its flexibility? And the technical term is deformability. Different about why didn’t you just say flexible? No, they call it deformability. And so that’s what allows it to squeeze into the little capillary spaces. And what allows it to have that deformability is energy, energy production. And it’s anaerobic glycolysis. That has 10 enzymes. How many of them require magnesium? Eight? Wow, that’s a lot of enzyme activity. And that’s why the magnesium inside the red blood cell is so important to a clue about how resilient and energetic are these red blood cells. Because the more resilient and energetic they are, the longer they’re going to live. They’re supposed to live 120 days if they don’t have proper stores of magnesium and copper at their disposal.

The life cycle drops to 20 days, where’s the big difference between 120 days and 20 days. And so in its state of copper deficiency and a magnesium deficiency, we go back to Lucy and Ethel at the Chocolate Factory. When the manager walks in and says speeded up boys, when you have a very significant change in the life cycle, you’re suddenly stuffing stuff all over your body, right trying to.

And that’s what happens when the red blood cell only has a 20-day cycle to the pace that’s a six-fold increase in inactivity. So energy production for the red blood cell is very, very important. And it turns out that one of the most important things is that the process of going from a stem cell to a full immature red blood cell takes about two days. And about six or seven stages I think it’s seven stages in between.

But stage five is when the red when the earth’s void cell which is a precursor to a red blood cell. But the erythroid cell needs to offload the nucleolus, offload the mitochondria, and offload excess iron to it. So as the cell is maturing, realizes I can too much iron, I got it unloaded. And if it can’t unload that iron, it doesn’t become hemoglobin, which then doesn’t allow it to become a red blood cell.

So the inability to let the iron out through that Ferro port doorway becomes important, especially in the production of red blood cells. Again, over 2 million a second. Think about that, playing in the background as we’re listening, as we’re having this conversation, be thinking about trying to keep track of 2 million cells trying to offer it all a second. It’s just, it’s crazy. But that’s why I think that’s why Carl Sagan got into this question billions and billions. It’s like, we can’t even comprehend what’s going on.

So then we’re back to the most mysterious part of the human tablet. We know that the mitochondria, again 40 quadrillions, every cell 500, has a huge diversity in terms of going, from a liver cell to a brain cell in terms of how many mitochondria there are. And the mitochondria need to turn oxygen into the water.


Morley Robbins: And that process of turning Otoo into two molecules of h2o requires a pH of seven. And when that pH has right, three energy precursor cells, three ADP, already complex five to become three magnesium, ATP, and that’s the currency that runs the cell. The unknown, I think I think you’re gonna find this fascinating. Nobody knows how oxygen gets from outside the cell to the mitochondria.


Morley Robbins: There’s, there’s no, there’s no literature on it. The closest you’re going to come is where to send in Wilson. Wilson, I think his last name 2007. They had a theory, but no one’s able to substantiate it. We don’t know how oxygen gets from outside the cell into is it active transport is it just gaseous diffusion.

And the reason why I emphasize this is we’re talking about the second most reactive element on the planet. This is not, this is not some benign playdough we’re talking about this is highly reactive oxygen. And nobody knows how it gets to the mitochondria. I find that fascinating. And so the process of turning that oxygen into water, as we get into the electron transport chain, very important movement of electrons through the different complexes got to have the reducing factors in an ad plus and FADH to and is a very important NADH, not any each plus NADH.

But you’ve got to have these reducing factors. To support the movement of electrons, you’ve got to have the shuttle carriers, you’ve got to have Coenzyme Q and you’ve got to have cytochrome c? Well, it turns out that the cytochrome, BC complex, which hangs out in complex three, relies on Ubiquinol to receive it cytochrome c a complex for guess what it requires? What? What it relies on?


Morley Robbins: Retinal turns out retinal as an electron carrier that’s buried research. It’s amazing. So you start to take retinal out of your diet, you’re going to start to create a more reactive electron transport chain. Wow, that’s a good thing to know. And what is glucose do? Again, we seem to have a choice in our diet to in sugar and fat, right? They want us we be sugarless fat. They don’t want us eating as much fat? Well, if you have more sugar, it slows down the electrons. Does that sound like a good idea job to slow down electrons and the electron transport chain?

Do you think you’re going to create work statically, think you’re going to create more oxidative stress? No, of course, you are. And so that dynamic is taking place. And somewhere in this process. And I beg of you to be forgiving because nobody talks about this. But the process of getting oxygen to the mitochondria. We’re assuming that iron is still carrying the oxygen. And that iron. What after it’s chopped off its payload. And it’s and what is it? What form is it in? It’s in a plus-two form to carry oxygen. So when it’s transparent when it’s in ferritin, it’s plus three, but when it’s the waiter, which is 70% of the iron in your body is a waiter.

When it’s the waiter. It’s plus two and it needs to be recycled. into two very important metabolites, you got to be able to make heme protein. And you’ve got to be able to make Iron-sulfur clusters. And they come in different varieties, there’s, you know, two irons, three irons, four irons to depends on what part of the electron transport chain you’re trying to make. But the key is the mechanisms, the beginning of the heme process begins and ends with copper, as an enzyme, and Ferro Keila Taisce enzyme are copper-dependent.

And what’s useful for people to know is that, that the first and the last three enzymes to make him are taking place inside the matrix of the mitochondria. What’s hanging out the matrix, it’s 50,000. Atoms of, of copper. And copper might be involved in all aspects of it. So you’ve got four that are taking place outside of the mitochondria. But the four that are taking place inside the mitochondria are hanging out in the matrix. So really begins to suggest that the pivotal role that copper plays in this heme process, and especially the last step complex, or the enzyme eight, in making him is called Ferro Keilah Taisce. And Ferro Keila. Taisce is a crane that picks up iron

and then drops it into the center of the heme molecule. So it can go back out and get recycled. So it can go to be made into more hemoglobin to be made into more red blood cells. Very, very important process. And then the process to make Iron-sulfur clusters. Well, there’s a rate-limiting variable. And it’s called gluten, gluten, redox, and five, G or x live, well put on your thinking cap, you know who the battery is, it’s copper. So you can’t, you can’t make that pivotal enzyme work if it doesn’t have copper, and then that disrupts the production of iron-sulfur clusters.

And so this recycling process is, there’s this constant process of, of delivery of oxygen, it’s attached to iron, although no one can explain it in detail to my satisfaction. And iron doesn’t just hang out, it needs to be recycled and put into a form that can be reused. Why? Because if it can’t be reused, guess what happens? If copper is missing, the oxygen can’t be activated properly. Irons hanging out isn’t being recycled.

And then they come together as rust. And it’s its most basic disruption of mitochondrial activity is the inability to recycle iron and recycle oxygen into the water. And many scientists make the statement that the terminal destination for iron and oxygen is the mitochondria. And that’s exactly what they’re talking about. And that iron needs to be recycled, turned into him and iron-sulfur clusters. And the oxygen needs to be recycled into water. I don’t know where it goes. But the mitochondria are water wheels.

And if you’re not making water, it becomes a Ferris wheel. And then the Ferris wheel starts to create rust all over the body. So that hopefully gives you a better sense of what the dynamics are. And why iron recycling is so important.


Dr. Joel Rosen: Yeah, it’s funny, it’s I appreciate all the synapses that fired in your brain over the years to get that out today cuz that there’s a lot of insight in that for sure. It’s funny that you use that analogy because when I’m going over someone’s organic acid test results, and they show you the Krebs cycle, I tell them to think of it as a water wheel. Think of it as like you’re on the casino boat. And if the water doesn’t make a full revolution around, it’s going to spill out.

And that’s what we’re seeing and the cofactors are missing. And ultimately, so what’s interesting couple things that come to my mind is, as you know, with the genetics, and we talked about that beforehand, at the end of the day, if your cells are not breathing effectively, if you’re not making an income and you’re creating an expense, you could know all the seven standard deviations of genetic challenges that happen you still need to get the body to breathe effectively, and the intelligence of the body once it has a surplus it knows what to do with it and get out of it.

The way where I argue well, let’s also know that it knows what to do intelligently, let’s accelerate that. But aside from that, the thing that I think about is that I do a lot of training in functional genomics, and Dr. As we talked about Dr. Bob Miller, and he talked, he did a study a lime study. I don’t know if you’re aware of this. And he found out that those that had the more susceptibility with Ferro potent or H MOX, which is recycling HFP enzymes that had much more profound challenges, symptoms, problems expressions when they had the Lyme problem.

And now it makes me think of going back and looking at the copper, you know, taking it one step upstream and looking at the copper relationship, and even siphoning out how much more potent the expression of illness would be, not be, well, obviously, because you’re not exporting iron as effectively even if it is copper available or dependent. But the fact is, it’s very seldomly, the amount of copper is not there for those enzymes to work effectively. So that’s one of the things I think about.

The other thing I think about too, morally, is that I didn’t realize as Pharaoh potent is the only exporter in the body. I was only thinking about Intero sites, I wasn’t thinking along the lines of making red blood cells, right? So that’s like, boom, like, oh my gosh, that’s huge.


Morley Robbins: That’s not just red blood cells. It’s, it’s neurons, that’s astrocytes, it’s everything. It’s everything. Yeah. Once every cell doing, every cell is making energy. They can’t make any. And again, that to me, I’m baffled that no one has it’s either an oversight on sciences part, which I find hard to believe. But no one has been able to document what happens to iron and oxygen after the payload of oxygens made the mitochondria. What, what, what the heck’s going on here, folks?

I mean, it’s just, to me, it’s, it’s the most glaring gap in our understanding of physiology. And then you’re talking about the iron copper dynamics, you probably have friends who have an older brother. And when you were growing up, you probably witnessed the older brothers beating up on the younger brothers. I mean, I’ve got vivid memories of that. And so think of the younger brothers copper, older brothers iron, right.

And Jamie Collins, the University of Florida in Gainesville, and some amazing work to demonstrate that excess dietary iron crashes, copper metabolism. And he’s looking at it at a macro level and also at a cellular level. And it’s just, it’s so obvious, and what’s the backbone of our immune system was energy. But a critical factor is interleukin two. Well, interleukin two is copper-dependent. But both innate and acquired immune systems run on the energy of copper, but they also are critically dependent on copper.

And who’s talking about that? Besides you and me, I don’t know a lot of people talking about it. And so it’s just people have this very corralled perspective of how the body runs. What’s the narrative? It’s not nature, nature’s over here relying on minerals and energy and incredible signaling mechanisms. And we’re supposed to be that pathogens rule all and it’s come on, it’s so much more dynamic than that.

And I think it’s really important for people to forget, I think we’ve used this phrase, but you need to ask better questions and demand better answers. Because we’re, we’re not in kindergarten anymore. We’re at a very critical juncture. And I think we need to be very discerning about the quality of the information that we’re basing our decisions on. And I think that’s the importance of these, this exchange that we’re having as people are getting an injection of truth that they’ve never probably had heard before, at least in the sense of the intensity of this kind of conversation.


Dr. Joel Rosen: Yeah, it’s interesting to the other thing I thought about when you’re getting into the recycling and even before that was just the concept of frequency and you talked about melanin and we talked about circadian rhythm or times of the day where we have the dip and all cells work on a circadian rhythm, and they’re ultimately synchronizing with each other to work as a system and it’s all about communication and how copper allows the mitochondria and the and the As the computer chip to be able to have the information to communicate, and I also think about the fact that with the frequency of, or just the earth, right?

I mean, you think about where we’re minerals and mean, I remember like, as I’m trained as an as a chiropractor, one I used to do training and remember thinking about the innate intelligence, like, what’s the difference, you know, God forbid, if you got struck by lightning and you were dead, and or you were standing up, the difference is that energy in the body, that frequency that, that, just that, that energy that’s there.

And, and really, I’ve told people, if you could go on a time machine and go back 200 years where the minerals were plentiful in the earth, where we didn’t have Wi-Fi and social media, and we were able to maybe even the light bulb, and be able to go to bed, when when, when it gets dark out and or go camping and get synchronized with the earth and have that frequency of the soils and, and the nutrients to harmonize your cells. That’s probably the best medicine that you could ever do, right?

Morally, in terms of just getting out of the way, no matter how complicated, you just described, what you described. And what we’ve been talking about, is simple in terms of getting the body what it needs, removing what it doesn’t need, and letting the magic happen on its own, it’s easier said than done. But ultimately, it’s getting the proper frequencies of the Earth, getting the body communicating with the Earth, that’s what grounding is, and electrons and so forth, making sure that you’re getting rid of the static electricity, if you will, and then being able to build up the reserves so that you’re not, you know, only paying interest payments, if you will, and you keep falling further and further behind on the metabolic drift and you’re getting closer to that waterfall.

And you don’t even have to think about it, you’re just doing it naturally. It’s a, it’s quite amazing. As I always say morally, as bad as it is. Now I do feel it because I’m from Canada. And like people used to make fun of me when I went and moved to the US because there was the whole sort of I think Canada has a little bit of an inferiority complex, but there’s a certain amount of, hey, like, it’s obnoxious, and you go there, and I say, You know what, at the end of the day, it’s the best of the best than the worst of the worst.

And I do feel like that’s where we are in healthcare and where we are in the world. And the information you bring forward is where the best of the best and the worst of the worst, and we know so much more than we ever have known. And the body is incredibly resilient when you get out of the way. And you allow it to do what it needs to do. Lots of amazing things that you talked about, as far as I’m sure we could do a part four, as far as any loose ends, that you want to add to that. I mean, I know just when you were talking about the recycling of iron, and I know a lot of people talk about, crypto pie rolls and having that problem. At the end of the day, I think about it’s a copper, copper issue. That’s a huge thing. And the other thing that was enlightening when you told me is just that RBC, magnesium, and how deformable red blood cell is for it to get into the tissues to make ATP and why it’s so important to have that magnesium. Any other sort of things that you want to bring up that kind of comes up in your head when with all the things that I just mentioned?


Morley Robbins: Yeah, no, I think it’s useful for the listener to step back from this discussion. Again, I give high marks to Joe for having this kind of dialogue. Not a lot of people have this kind of freedom we’ll dive into reality. But I think it’s important for the listener to kind of step back and just ponder this idea that there is no such thing as iron deficiency anemia.

It does, it makes no sense on a geophysical level and a metabolic level. And maybe someday we can get into the real reality that but that becomes one of the cornerstones of belief is that anemia exists. So then I’ve got to feed iron, it’s the worst possible thing you can do is, is put excess iron into the human body. And then the second, the second issue to come to terms with is there’s no such thing as a medical disease. It doesn’t exist. There is stress-induced mineral dysregulation that causes metabolic dysfunction. And one phrase for that is adrenal fatigue or hypothyroidism or whatever.

Whatever. Your favorite Termas. But at the end of the day, every condition attached to a symptom, the reason for the title of the book and hold the book up real quick if you would, Joe, you know, there’s a method to my madness, it cures your fatigue, what isn’t just adrenal fatigue, we’re talking about energy deficiency at the cellular level. And when you realize that it’s that there’s this deficit and energy that precedes every other breakdown in the body, whether we’re talking about one standard deviation out to six or seven standard deviations, it becomes the most important understanding that there’s this planet, our life revolves around energy.

What’s the famous expression that equals MC squared? energy equals mass times the speed of light? Well, what does that mean? Energy is a function, or it gets translated into structure and function. And if the energy changes, the structure and function of the tissue changes, it’s an energetic equation. If it isn’t that, oh, well, there was some demonic bug that got into my body and I lost no, you, you lost your energy homeostasis.

And that changed the whole physiology of energy dynamics, which then changed the cellular dynamics. And it’s important to have that sense, of understanding that there is one mechanism of this disease, and it evolves around energy deficiency, the phrase that I used in the book has fatigue, just so people could, could grasp it. But I think it’s so important for people to realize that that is this is it’s always playing in the background. And the point that you made earlier, Joe, which is very important.

at a macro level, you may feel just fine. But any symptom that you’ve got a headache, you know, stiff joints, bowel dysfunction, you know, blurry eyes, whatever it happens to be liver, you know, nonalcoholic, fatty liver disease, heart disease, Lyme disease, doesn’t matter what the expression is, at the very basis of it, is tissue is not able to make adequate energy to stay in the base in harmony and homeostasis. That’s the underlying truth of how our, our body works.

And it’s an important principle, though, to realize that when I do have a symptom, well, I must be dealing with some stress and begin to, to begin to peel back that onion to find out what that stressor is, is it something dietary is something environmental, is it some, some relationship issue or whatever it happens to be, and begin to understand that there’s always a price to pay for the stress in our world out here is going to turn into oxidative stress in our body, and, and some parts of our body are better equipped to handle that stress than others.

And if there’s a chronic, perpetual issue in her life, well, the organ that’s attached to that emotion, and the Chinese figured this out 1000s of years ago, that Oregon is going to be more mentally challenged, because it’s been dealing with more stress. And that begins to explain some of the varieties of symptoms that people have within a community or within a family or whatever the unit of abstraction is.


Dr. Joel Rosen: Yeah, it’s a paradigm shift of what energy is for and ultimately, life is never smooth sailing. And, you know, when we come to a hill and we’re in a car, you can’t maintain the same speed to necessarily overcome it, you have to put more pressure in the accelerator to overcome that and that’s the analogy is when you have bigger stress in your life, you need to produce energy to bring your body back to normal or always changing which is amazing the thing that I would probably plant the seed for now morally is now that we understand the what we’re not being told and I liked the words misled and miss fed.

It comes down to that some that’s a priority now not much I was doing a lot of thinking after we got off the call last time and it’s important to make sure people are educated and I love the word democratization of healthcare, democracy, the democratization of energy, and giving it back to the user but the deeper purpose of going forward and removing

The barriers that don’t allow us to understand these things and being misled and the fact that we’re missing fed and, and the reasons for that I think that there’s a deeper purpose in educating a community and helping them democratize energy has to come through laws being written and, and companies being penalized, and so forth and so on. But amazing conversation nonetheless.

And I, you know, and I always ask someone, and I’d be interested in you this as well, even though I’m keeping it open for part four, five, and six is, you know, one of the things that I asked my guests are, if you would have known now, what you would have wished you would have known then, or with the sage-like morally that knows his information that he knows now, with sort of the bright-eyed and bushy-tailed Morley, when you were going through life and having some obstacles and so forth, so foretold you have wished you would have told that more naive or not understanding Morley guy that would have accelerated your learning curve or helped you get over the hump quicker, what would have been the most useful piece of information that you wish you would have known then that you know, now?


Morley Robbins: When you’re, when you’re in college, and you want to be a doctor, and you’re going to a pre-med program, which is very rigorous, and you can imagine, you’ve gone through a program, you know, how just physically and emotionally exhausting, but at an undergraduate level is pretty demanding. And you get to the end of the process, and you come up empty? And, you know, you get rejections. And so the natural conclusion is, I wasn’t smart enough.

And so you, you start your adult life, thinking that you’re not smart enough. And that becomes sort of a handicap, if you will, for going forward. I think what the sage in me now would say, you know, first of all, maybe you would have been a lousy doctor, that that would be a good thing to know. But you didn’t get low grades, because you’re not smart.

You got low grades because you see the game differently. And you didn’t understand and this was my dilemma. It’s like, why do I need to know what the Doppler effect is? If I want to be a surgeon? I couldn’t, I couldn’t connect those dots, just to it wasn’t just enough to say why I mastered the Doppler effect. And therefore I get I just like, this makes no sense at all.

Why am I and so I think what I’ve learned, since that a more sensitive period of my life, is that I wasn’t learning? What made sense to me, I wasn’t learning the right things. I wasn’t studying the right areas, and by a quirk of fate, and I do mean a quirk, the universe said, well, let’s, let’s see what he does with this mineral thing. And it became, to me it became oxygen, I was able to breathe, maybe for the first time in my life professionally to see, wow, I do understand this. But it was in a language that I understood immediately. And then it was a, it was a subject matter that I get excited talking about and wanting to teach people and then wanting to expand that to reach as many people as I can.

I love your goal of reaching 100 million people. I think that’s, that’s ambitious and bold, and it’s exactly the right number. And the thing is, when we’re in our 20s, we’re very vulnerable. Now, I’m 6 of a few weeks ago, and I’ve lived have lived a very full life, very, have had amazing experiences for kids who are just off the charts, in terms of their talents on many levels. But I’ve had life experiences that I never would have expected to have. But I’ve been blessed with an opportunity to do my life’s work, which is not many people can say that, that I can.

Honestly, Ralph Waldo Emerson has a famous poem on success. And I love that poem. And one of my favorite parts of that poem is to know that one life has breathed easier. And I think you experienced this in your practice as well, you, you have touched 1000s and 1000s of lives and you know, under your interaction, there are better people for and I’ve, I’ve been able to experience that and witness that.

And when I first met Dr. Liz, I was mesmerized by the 1000s of people. She had touched in her chiropractic career. And just the following that she had and I didn’t have any of that. I didn’t know I didn’t. I was so in all of it. I never imagined that in my lifetime. I would be able to experience anything that even comes close to it. So I think it’s important for people to realize that sometimes you if it appears that the door is closing, you know, sounding music, there is always a window that’s opening.

And it may take years and years for that window to open. But to know and believe in yourself, that you, you do have a reason for being here, we all have a purpose in being on this planet, we’re here to learn lessons. And I never would have predicted the focus that I have or the kind of impact that it’s having.

And it’s, it’s a very special moment to know that, that there’s a community, a growing community of people who get excited about these dots that are being connected. And that people can springboard with the work that they do as you do, and other people who just say, I just want to help people with the RCP are what doesn’t matter what the venue is. But it’s these foundational components that are making sense, but they’re also allowing people to have their life back.

And I think that’s a very special moment. And I think, you know, in retrospect, I don’t know that I could have understood what that sage person is now saying, you want to have in my 20s, I was an insufferable pain in the butt to deal with. And I don’t know that I really would have understood it. But now looking back, as you pose the question, it sure would have been nice to try to tap into that and, and let the younger Turk know that there’s, there are different avenues of expression, and go easy on yourself, and just find the one that feels right for you.

And if the first couple of paths doesn’t make sense, then keep trying. Because there is a path the world went to follow. But we need to go through sometimes the schools of Hard Knocks that are very uncomfortable, very painful. But they’re very profound and their ability to prepare us for our calling if you will.


Dr. Joel Rosen: Yeah, it’s a great answer. And I think the, I guess the answer, though, because there’s so much you put in there, I guess the answer that I’m inferring, as you would have told that, that that younger morally, it’s okay. To not worry about the fact that this doesn’t interest you redefine how you’re interpreting it in terms of you’re not dumb. It’s just not in your it’s not in your wheelhouse. And, yeah, yeah. And but the thing is, that’s an important lesson with the people that I teach to is, is that it’s the, it’s the spin we put on things.

And sometimes I feel like the best answers, which you kind of did mention, I don’t think I would have been ready for it. And you know, when the teacher is a student is ready, the teacher will appear right. And I think a lot of the time, we put a lot of energy and negative energy into something that is serving us to get to the next step to the next step to the next step and be sage-like in those when it’s under when it’s unfolding so that you don’t attach negative energy to it, or at least stress-energy or hypoxic inducing energy that causes a major problem.

And most importantly, what I tell clients is to Be grateful for that. But you know, be very grateful, like if I had not questioned if I had just had a different personality, and I would have just studied that, would I have been a good doctor? Would I have been happy?

What have I had a midlife crisis, and put that gratitude of I’m so grateful that I, I figured it out? And I had to go through those trials and tribulations like that’s back to the analogy again, of having to put your foot on the accelerator where the only way that you’re going to sail in a sailboat is if there is a wind if there is no wind, you’re not going anywhere. Now, if the winds coming in your face, it’s a lot harder, but you could talk back and forth and get to where you want to get to. So I think it’s really important to put that gratitude spin on it and be grateful for an embrace and, and not just sort of go through the emotion or the saying of I’m grateful but energetically feeling that gratitude.

And so there’s lots of wisdom and what you said there Marley I do appreciate our conversations and, and your insight. And, you know, again, probably hopefully everyone’s that listening to this as listening to the first and the second one. But just always like a good call to action on where they get the reports or where they learn more about the stops and starts they can get the book on any place where they get the booking service, but where are they getting the information to know more about everything we’ve talked about today?


Morley Robbins:
Now the website is the name of the movement, if you will, it’s the root cause protocol RCP So the website is RCP 123 dot o RG there are two social media landing sites, there’s a mag Facebook group about over 205,000 people now. And we’ve got a Facebook page all about the RCP. I think there’s like 30 or 40,000. There. So it’s just it’s a mind-blowing set of people. And then again, the book, of course, you go to any platform that you feel comfortable buying from, you’re not going to find it in your local bookstore.

This is not good. We’re not quite there yet. There is going to be an ebook version as well as the physical, and there will be an audio in the spring. Hopefully by April as that’s the goal. And people always wanting to reach out, they’re very welcome to contact me by my email, Morley And my phone is 847-922-8061.

The website has information about the protocol, the RCP, stops and starts it has information about research that we’re doing has information on the training that we do, the next class or group 15 will startup, I believe it’s February 9, which I think it’s a Thursday, and it will go for 16 weeks going forward. A lot of people find that to be an important stepping stone to incorporating these concepts, whether they are licensed professionals like yourself, or just citizen scientist that wants to make a difference in their community.

So it’s a useful way to incorporate the information. The research has all been kind of compiled so people can learn it in bite-sized pieces. And we’re just very excited to have this opportunity to share this information with folks.


Dr. Joel Rosen: Yeah, awesome. Well, listen again, we’ll keep it open for part four. And learn a lot on my own. When you do these talks with me, especially with the recycling of iron. There’s some aha that I always get with that. And definitely at the end of the day, it comes down to taking action with the information. It’s not just a feel-good. Hear it.

If you don’t apply it, it’s like you didn’t even hear it. So make sure whatever you do with the information, less is more removed the things that deplete your cells ability to breathe effectively. Do the things that help yourselves do that as well and start to get out of the way and see things happen. So morally, thank you so much for everything that you do, and look forward to our next conversation. Likewise,


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